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on this show skeptic oh I mean you say

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you've listened for a while I mean I

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started out really on a pretty

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straightforward path of looking at this

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consciousness stuff and I'm telling you

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no matter where you start you wind up

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with all this weirdness that's just

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unavoidable so you know try and take our

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story right now and try and take

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Puharich and try and stay between the

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little white lines it's impossible to do

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you know you're gonna wind up talking

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about all this wacky stuff and and so

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we're gonna talk in a minute about I

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want to stay finish talking about early

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Geller and about his work at SR I and

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this again straight up parapsychology

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work that's being done this is the basis

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of parapsychology and really the

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foundation of it is this work that's

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done at Stanford Research Institute but

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in a minute we're gonna say screw all

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that it's just such piddly crap compared

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to where these guys are going because

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you have somebody like regular and he's

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saying great you know you think it's

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cool that I can bend these spoons and

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Wow

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but let me tell you it's really all

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about the aliens and the ETS and the

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other connection and then lo and behold

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you know as you're gonna tell us in a

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minute when we start talking about the

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nine and and maybe we're ready to start

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talking about that now I mean this is

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where aundrea starts to go and it's it's

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he doesn't go there he's taken there I

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mean whether like so many of these

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experiences that people have you know

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it's not where you want to go it's where

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the experience wants to take you so

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maybe even lead us into talking about

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the nine of course yeah I think you know

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with with Geller you know like I said

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before with the the surface level stuff

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I mean a lot of people know about the

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the s RI experiments and it's easy to

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look up you know the video and the

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documentation but you know there is sort

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of this whole story going on behind this

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the currents in a sense with with

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hara-chan Geller with especially with

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Maharaj his book and you know that book

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basically sort of threw poo hard so far

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out there you know he sort of lost

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credibility with all the you know real

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scientific people the academic people he

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would associate with and people thought

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he was not something that was really the

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turning point where they said this guy's

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you know this is totally far out at

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Geller even you know distant trying to

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distance himself from flourish after

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that book came out it's just it's really

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just a story a lot of people don't know

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about when it comes together when it

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comes to their relationship I mean and

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the crazy thing is that book was it was

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a best-seller and it was published by

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doubleday which Wow I didn't know that

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which today is that one of the biggest

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publishing houses it was a best-seller

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and and so he really got to think it

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always comes back to you know what was

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hard his intentions here with this book

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was well well you know what I think we

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got to jump in then and talk about the

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nine and then you can help us understand

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the the timeline and how it fits into

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Puharich his life because you know I

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have a feeling I didn't think of this

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before but this must have been going on

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for him in a way that you know caused

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him to think differently and eventually

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I guess he just had probably had to

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share that and get that out so what do

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you think about what would tell let me

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rephrase that tell us about the nine

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tell us you know what is the nine who it

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was that's about this amazing seance he

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had who was there what happened and and

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it who was there it's like a big part of

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this this is like yeah unbelievable

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heavy hitters hmm yeah the history of

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the nine is this goes back to once again

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the roundtable foundation which was a

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research laboratory of that goo hara

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China up in Maine in the early 50s and

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the quick the quick story is he a lot of

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people would visit the roundtable

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foundation you know all sorts of people

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psych

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medians and everything and when up

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Thanks thank you I just got delivered of

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coffee sorry hehe yeah so people would

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visit all the time you know pretty

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strange people blue large would sort of

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evaluate them study them you know are

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these people the real deal are they a

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little you know if he and so one day

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this this Indian fellow I came into the

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roundtable Foundation a guy by the name

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of V not dr. V not and you know he was

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allegedly a medium and him and Boo harsh

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it it off and so this one night which

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you know there's documentation of

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there's tape recordings of and

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everything you know this guy v nod

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allegedly it goes into this trance and

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he starts to channel what he's calling

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is this entity of the nine and so he

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goes into this trance starts sort of

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spewing out all this really far-out

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information I starts you know telling to

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harsh things about his personal life

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that was really shocking and so that

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really affected Puharich I mean he at

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that time he was really just tipping

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over into the spiritual side of stuff

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and I think he was really interested in

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this guy v nod and this thing denying

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that he was allegedly channeling and so

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you know they they recorded it

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and shortly after that March you know

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went off to the mushroom stuff so the

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nine was sort of this thing that happens

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it was very interested in it but I think

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he sort of left it there and didn't go

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back to it for a long time so let me

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just interject here because I just had

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it up on the screen I don't want to blow

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past this too quickly that so the nine

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and I'm gonna go ahead and read this off

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of the off the screen for folks and then

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we can talk a little bit more about it

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but in in real kind of simple terms on

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December 31st 1952 through an Indian

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teacher who was visiting the u.s.

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Puharich made contact with the nine that

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is nine ascended beings supposedly

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spiritual beings

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a group of high beings who have had a

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long and direct involvement with

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humanity's evolution okay this is the

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kind of new we all know immediately we

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recognize this as the kind of New Age

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ish kind of crazy channeling stuff that

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everybody channels yeah but this gets

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really really weird in terms of the

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information that they're able to bring

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back the verification of it over the

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years and this becomes something that

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stays with Puharich for 20 30 40 years

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right I mean it may be telling us

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through the timeline because he also

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gets involved with this it works at this

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initial seance that he has that is very

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CIA connected and then that after a

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couple years that stops but then he

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finds this other medium years later in

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Florida and he starts it up again with

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some more crazy folks including Bob

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Denver you know one of those famous

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entertainers of the time and some other

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really really noteworthy people so

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there's a huge story to tell here we

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can't tell it all but again that's why

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Greg is making this myth film and and

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that's why he needs your help in making

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this film because you can tell this is a

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really important story to get out there

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fill in some of the pieces are missing

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about this long-standing experience he

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has with these ascended beings who have

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a direct involvement with humanity's

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evolution I mean you can't get you can't

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get bigger than that right yeah it's

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unbelievable I think you know like I

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said is his first interaction like he

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just read was through this guy the v-not

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and I it really affected him who heart I

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think this is when he first really got

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interested in the channeling stuff in a

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big way and so you're right that the

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nine was this thing that really was a

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part of his life basically until he died

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in the 90

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and so if you cut from the 50s with this

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Indian fellow Veen early seventies if

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you read Andria's book on hurry he

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references the nine and you know

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allegedly through certain mediums

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Guha Rogers able to communicate with

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them I mean do we know of the accuracy

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of that of course we don't know but you

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know even through through Geller if you

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read his book you can you can see that

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Andre was communicating with the nine

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through Geller through these tape

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recordings you know a tape tape machine

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would magically start recording out of

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nowhere and they would listen back to

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the tape and it would be you know the

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nine is things like this it's totally

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totally far out and you know if you cut

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to the mid-70s 74 75 like you said he is

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meeting a woman named Phyllis Schlemmer

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and pretty

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and which is based in Florida and I

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think you know a lot of people at this

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time you know Puharich became this sort

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of big figure in the in the

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parapsychology world and you know he was

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very thought after people would travel

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all from all over the world who come

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visit him and talk to him and work with

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him we had a little bit of a gap there

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but I think we can pick up right exactly

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where we left off we're talking about

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the nine and this amazing session that

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series of long-term decade Long's

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seances channeling sessions that he's

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having with extraterrestrial beings I

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don't know

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that's what's reported and I think where

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we left off in the story was with this

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woman so tell us about Phyllis in and

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how she fits into the timeline sure I

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think like right before we we left off

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here um you know I said people would

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were attracted to Andreea like you know

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mediums its these all types channels and

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Psyche legit psychics and that they

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would come from all over just to meet

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him they wanted to you know be evaluated

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by him you know because he was the

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parapsychology guy who was the real deal

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and so I think you know Phyllis was was

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one of these these people who I think

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you know sort of tracked down

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Andreea was was in the mid-70s around 74

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75 and okay yeah so so Phyllis was um

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Phyllis Schlemmer was a medium who I got

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into contact with Oh hard in the mid

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seventies and like like Geller and blue

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Harish's relationship whoo [\h__\h] you

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know for for whatever reason was

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convinced that that Phyllis schlimmer

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was the real deal she was a she was a

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great medium she could apparently go

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into these trances and you know what

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I've always found interesting about the

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channeling stuff is you know and I've

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never seen this firsthand but you know

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apparently these people sort of

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completely leave their body you know and

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they let this entity whether it's the

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nine or whatever it is sort of totally

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take them over and

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when they when they snap out of it you

271
00:12:11,019 --> 00:12:08,750
know they don't remember a thing about

272
00:12:12,910 --> 00:12:11,029
what happened about what they said and

273
00:12:15,490 --> 00:12:12,920
so apparently that would happen with

274
00:12:20,050 --> 00:12:15,500
Phyllis Schlemmer all the time so the

275
00:12:22,900 --> 00:12:20,060
story goes you know whether you want to

276
00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:22,910
believe this to be the truth or not

277
00:12:28,570 --> 00:12:24,890
you know Phyllis you know had fallen

278
00:12:30,550 --> 00:12:28,580
into a trance and who pops up is the

279
00:12:33,610 --> 00:12:30,560
nine starts you know coming through her

280
00:12:36,340 --> 00:12:33,620
and so this starts blue hearts all over

281
00:12:38,620 --> 00:12:36,350
again on the nine you know he apparently

282
00:12:41,110 --> 00:12:38,630
had come into contact with them through

283
00:12:43,780 --> 00:12:41,120
the Indian medium in the 50s and now we

284
00:12:45,040 --> 00:12:43,790
cut to the early 70s mid 70s he's

285
00:12:47,019 --> 00:12:45,050
hearing from them again through a

286
00:12:49,510 --> 00:12:47,029
totally separate medium Phyllis

287
00:12:52,420 --> 00:12:49,520
Schlemmer so this starts him off on this

288
00:12:53,980 --> 00:12:52,430
whole journey with Phyllis at that time

289
00:12:57,280 --> 00:12:53,990
they're also working with the guy named

290
00:13:00,519 --> 00:12:57,290
John Whitmore who at one time was a very

291
00:13:03,370 --> 00:13:00,529
famous racecar driver a guy from from

292
00:13:07,180 --> 00:13:03,380
the UK he was interested in what Buhari

293
00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:07,190
was doing joined up with him and so you

294
00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:09,770
know Guha rich John Whitmore and Phyllis

295
00:13:13,720 --> 00:13:11,330
Schlemmer you know they traveled all

296
00:13:15,940 --> 00:13:13,730
over the globe you know allegedly being

297
00:13:17,170 --> 00:13:15,950
told by the nine they need to go here

298
00:13:20,170 --> 00:13:17,180
and they need to go there then you know

299
00:13:22,510 --> 00:13:20,180
meditate for world peace and it's just

300
00:13:25,930 --> 00:13:22,520
such a crazy story I mean there's photos

301
00:13:27,730 --> 00:13:25,940
those videos but it really just raises

302
00:13:30,850 --> 00:13:27,740
the question you know what was really I

303
00:13:32,920 --> 00:13:30,860
mean what would what would really cause

304
00:13:34,630 --> 00:13:32,930
them to to do this to really you know

305
00:13:37,180 --> 00:13:34,640
travel all over the globe but the

306
00:13:39,010 --> 00:13:37,190
allegedly being told to do so by this by

307
00:13:42,340 --> 00:13:39,020
this entity and it's very well it's

308
00:13:44,079 --> 00:13:42,350
crazy that we call it a crazy story I

309
00:13:47,260 --> 00:13:44,089
mean I think we have to consider that

310
00:13:49,180 --> 00:13:47,270
you know be in the in the break the

311
00:13:51,130 --> 00:13:49,190
brief break that we had I called you on

312
00:13:53,199 --> 00:13:51,140
the phone and we talked for a minute I'm

313
00:13:55,570 --> 00:13:53,209
real glad I'm able to introduce this you

314
00:13:57,610 --> 00:13:55,580
know I had the opportunity not too long

315
00:14:00,220 --> 00:13:57,620
ago I've interviewed him a couple times

316
00:14:03,430 --> 00:14:00,230
but I interviewed dr. Jeffrey Mishlove

317
00:14:08,079 --> 00:14:03,440
on skeptic oh and people know him from

318
00:14:10,090 --> 00:14:08,089
his long-running PBS show thinking aloud

319
00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:10,100
and now new thinking aloud and he has

320
00:14:15,610 --> 00:14:12,650
hundreds of videos with a lot of the

321
00:14:19,449 --> 00:14:15,620
leading lights if you will in

322
00:14:23,730 --> 00:14:19,459
parapsychology and now into spirituality

323
00:14:27,189 --> 00:14:23,740
guy is a Cal Berkeley PhD he pretty much

324
00:14:30,280 --> 00:14:27,199
plays it close to the vest in terms of a

325
00:14:33,609 --> 00:14:30,290
scientist he is a scientist in every

326
00:14:36,609 --> 00:14:33,619
respect I got the PhD he also has these

327
00:14:38,410 --> 00:14:36,619
connections to Stanford Research

328
00:14:41,189 --> 00:14:38,420
Institute again a part of it is because

329
00:14:44,199 --> 00:14:41,199
he was up there he was at Berkeley but I

330
00:14:45,549 --> 00:14:44,209
got to introduce the story to the mix

331
00:14:50,290 --> 00:14:45,559
because I think it's completely

332
00:14:54,280 --> 00:14:50,300
completely relevant but Mishlove is a

333
00:14:58,269 --> 00:14:54,290
guy who is interested in parapsychology

334
00:15:00,280 --> 00:14:58,279
and he's there with Stanford research he

335
00:15:03,340 --> 00:15:00,290
goes to their doorstep and he starts

336
00:15:05,919 --> 00:15:03,350
hanging around and he'll put off and

337
00:15:08,739 --> 00:15:05,929
Russell Targ say hey you're interested

338
00:15:12,340 --> 00:15:08,749
in this stuff let me throw something at

339
00:15:15,340 --> 00:15:12,350
you we got this guy who we can't seem to

340
00:15:19,119 --> 00:15:15,350
get rid of his name is Ted Owens you can

341
00:15:22,689 --> 00:15:19,129
see him here and Ted Owens is this guy

342
00:15:26,019 --> 00:15:22,699
who is talking to us about these crazy

343
00:15:27,970 --> 00:15:26,029
experiences he's having with aliens and

344
00:15:30,100 --> 00:15:27,980
aliens are visiting him and they're

345
00:15:32,079 --> 00:15:30,110
sending him all these messages and you

346
00:15:34,059 --> 00:15:32,089
know what and they try to slow them off

347
00:15:35,769 --> 00:15:34,069
you know like we don't have enough crazy

348
00:15:38,499 --> 00:15:35,779
stuff going on we meet a guy who's

349
00:15:41,249 --> 00:15:38,509
talking to aliens we're trying to just

350
00:15:43,090 --> 00:15:41,259
get regular and set up some

351
00:15:44,230 --> 00:15:43,100
parapsychology experiments because this

352
00:15:47,470 --> 00:15:44,240
stuff is all starting to come together

353
00:15:49,329 --> 00:15:47,480
right so this stuff goes off yet he

354
00:15:52,119 --> 00:15:49,339
starts working with Ted Owens but the

355
00:15:54,789 --> 00:15:52,129
reason I bring all this up is it's the

356
00:15:57,100 --> 00:15:54,799
exact same story only he's got even more

357
00:16:00,340 --> 00:15:57,110
interesting stuff going on where Ted

358
00:16:02,470 --> 00:16:00,350
Owens is making the weather change and

359
00:16:04,869 --> 00:16:02,480
then there's documentation that the

360
00:16:08,350 --> 00:16:04,879
weather changes he's making the UFOs

361
00:16:11,439 --> 00:16:08,360
show up and they show up right where

362
00:16:15,309 --> 00:16:11,449
they're supposed to and when you talk to

363
00:16:17,859 --> 00:16:15,319
Mishlove he's like I don't get it he

364
00:16:20,799 --> 00:16:17,869
wrote this book the PK man anyone can go

365
00:16:24,579 --> 00:16:20,809
read it any documents these years that

366
00:16:26,410 --> 00:16:24,589
he spent with Ted Owens a same kind of

367
00:16:28,299 --> 00:16:26,420
thing tracking him around the world

368
00:16:30,129 --> 00:16:28,309
saying hey come on over here

369
00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:30,139
they got this forest they're gonna give

370
00:16:36,970 --> 00:16:32,690
us this message here's this message and

371
00:16:40,090 --> 00:16:36,980
I just wonder at what point do we have

372
00:16:43,150 --> 00:16:40,100
to step back and say okay rather than

373
00:16:45,820 --> 00:16:43,160
all the caveats and qualifications and

374
00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:45,830
the need we have for people not to think

375
00:16:50,320 --> 00:16:48,530
we're totally crazy what have we just

376
00:16:52,470 --> 00:16:50,330
take it is straight up that's what's

377
00:16:55,900 --> 00:16:52,480
happening there's these

378
00:16:57,970 --> 00:16:55,910
extraterrestrials and somehow they've

379
00:17:01,090 --> 00:16:57,980
managed they have a technology that

380
00:17:03,910 --> 00:17:01,100
allows them to access this realm that we

381
00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:03,920
reach in mediumship or in deep

382
00:17:08,949 --> 00:17:05,930
meditation or in psychedelics and

383
00:17:11,110 --> 00:17:08,959
they're in that realm and they're coming

384
00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:11,120
through and they're sending those

385
00:17:20,050 --> 00:17:15,410
messages and take that if you will and

386
00:17:23,230 --> 00:17:20,060
fit that back into Puharich is story I

387
00:17:25,960 --> 00:17:23,240
mean what does he say about that well if

388
00:17:28,900 --> 00:17:25,970
we took it that way what does he say is

389
00:17:32,500 --> 00:17:28,910
the whole purpose and meaning of the

390
00:17:36,970 --> 00:17:32,510
nine what should we be doing based on

391
00:17:40,540 --> 00:17:36,980
what he found out from the 9 mm oh yeah

392
00:17:43,120 --> 00:17:40,550
it's it's so it's fascinating that the

393
00:17:45,790 --> 00:17:43,130
Mishlove story you can compare it almost

394
00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:45,800
right back to to Haaretz because once

395
00:17:50,470 --> 00:17:48,170
again if you read the book hurry

396
00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:50,480
written by Andre Puharich it's the same

397
00:17:54,970 --> 00:17:52,330
thing they were getting these messages

398
00:17:57,820 --> 00:17:54,980
through the nine telling them to go do

399
00:17:59,440 --> 00:17:57,830
certain things and you know it's all

400
00:18:02,460 --> 00:17:59,450
documented it's you know obviously you

401
00:18:05,260 --> 00:18:02,470
can believe it or not believe it but you

402
00:18:09,310 --> 00:18:05,270
know I was thinking a lot about this

403
00:18:12,070 --> 00:18:09,320
recently I was reading an article and

404
00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:12,080
you know this whole idea that he like

405
00:18:16,540 --> 00:18:14,090
you said maybe if you're in a deep

406
00:18:18,730 --> 00:18:16,550
trance or through a medium that might be

407
00:18:21,730 --> 00:18:18,740
some way that you know it is possible to

408
00:18:24,900 --> 00:18:21,740
communicate with you know said entities

409
00:18:28,150 --> 00:18:24,910
but you know a lot of the nines message

410
00:18:30,430 --> 00:18:28,160
which I am also very interested in how

411
00:18:32,140 --> 00:18:30,440
this works is you know the medium like I

412
00:18:34,420 --> 00:18:32,150
said before if completely falls out of

413
00:18:36,370 --> 00:18:34,430
their body and when they come to they

414
00:18:38,500 --> 00:18:36,380
have no memory of what they said but

415
00:18:40,540 --> 00:18:38,510
it's all on tape and then they're saying

416
00:18:43,690 --> 00:18:40,550
this very intricate you know very

417
00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:43,700
articulate stuff I mean is physics

418
00:18:46,150 --> 00:18:45,770
science mathematics all this kind of

419
00:18:48,250 --> 00:18:46,160
stuff

420
00:18:51,490 --> 00:18:48,260
who especially in the case of Phyllis

421
00:18:54,130 --> 00:18:51,500
Schlemmer would you know otherwise you

422
00:18:56,920 --> 00:18:54,140
know not be able to to discuss or talk

423
00:18:59,050 --> 00:18:56,930
about like the South Florida who's just

424
00:19:01,060 --> 00:18:59,060
hanging out giving reading yeah you know

425
00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:01,070
that's what really intrigued me about I

426
00:19:05,770 --> 00:19:03,770
mean of course the the story but even

427
00:19:07,780 --> 00:19:05,780
just in a general sense about you know

428
00:19:09,580 --> 00:19:07,790
channels and in mediums you know there's

429
00:19:10,930 --> 00:19:09,590
a couple instances where this this is

430
00:19:14,440 --> 00:19:10,940
the case where these people would

431
00:19:16,780 --> 00:19:14,450
otherwise not be you know intellectually

432
00:19:19,030 --> 00:19:16,790
trained enough to even discuss this

433
00:19:21,820 --> 00:19:19,040
stuff but you know the nines message was

434
00:19:23,290 --> 00:19:21,830
very much you know trying to save the

435
00:19:25,360 --> 00:19:23,300
planet I mean there's a book called the

436
00:19:28,360 --> 00:19:25,370
only planet of choice that was written

437
00:19:29,830 --> 00:19:28,370
by Schlemmer which was basically mostly

438
00:19:31,510 --> 00:19:29,840
transcripts from the wreck of the

439
00:19:33,520 --> 00:19:31,520
recording sessions that she did with

440
00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:33,530
blue hearts when she was in trance and a

441
00:19:38,770 --> 00:19:36,890
lot of it is you know it's the typical

442
00:19:40,870 --> 00:19:38,780
sort of channeled stuff but we know I

443
00:19:42,910 --> 00:19:40,880
need to remember back then it was it was

444
00:19:44,650 --> 00:19:42,920
the first time this was happening now

445
00:19:47,710 --> 00:19:44,660
you know we see these channels and it's

446
00:19:49,330 --> 00:19:47,720
all the same stuff very new age kind of

447
00:19:52,570 --> 00:19:49,340
content but back then you know it was

448
00:19:55,270 --> 00:19:52,580
about you know mostly World Peace you

449
00:19:57,820 --> 00:19:55,280
know saving the planet saving humanity

450
00:19:59,710 --> 00:19:57,830
sort of raising the the consciousness

451
00:20:01,210 --> 00:19:59,720
level of humanity trying to get people

452
00:20:04,060 --> 00:20:01,220
to just think differently about all

453
00:20:05,620 --> 00:20:04,070
these things and you know as we said we

454
00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:05,630
see with Puharich that message really

455
00:20:10,810 --> 00:20:07,730
stuck with him and I like I said until

456
00:20:12,490 --> 00:20:10,820
the early 90s he was still talking about

457
00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:12,500
the nine he was still writing about the

458
00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:14,930
nine I mean I had a very sort of deep

459
00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:19,490
impact on him I think and it's just it's

460
00:20:24,220 --> 00:20:21,490
fascinating like I said if you just

461
00:20:25,780 --> 00:20:24,230
really google you can go and go down a

462
00:20:27,160 --> 00:20:25,790
rabbit hole of this stuff with the pool

463
00:20:30,010 --> 00:20:27,170
arch and the nine I mean it gets very

464
00:20:32,020 --> 00:20:30,020
conspiracy heavy at times but which it

465
00:20:34,360 --> 00:20:32,030
has to it just has to we shouldn't

466
00:20:37,420 --> 00:20:34,370
apologize for that because it's real now

467
00:20:39,210 --> 00:20:37,430
IRRI see stuff is real as we've outlined

468
00:20:42,190 --> 00:20:39,220
through all this talk I mean he cuz

469
00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:42,200
working with intelligence agencies and

470
00:20:48,730 --> 00:20:45,410
he is working with people who are deep

471
00:20:53,740 --> 00:20:48,740
deep state does he ever later in his

472
00:20:56,890 --> 00:20:53,750
life have any ideas on how he resolves

473
00:21:00,130 --> 00:20:56,900
these two worlds his two worlds I mean

474
00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:00,140
the one world of you know there are

475
00:21:03,730 --> 00:21:01,610
enemies over there those are the bad

476
00:21:05,770 --> 00:21:03,740
guys and we got to defeat the Russians

477
00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:05,780
or we got to defeat whoever it is you

478
00:21:15,040 --> 00:21:11,450
know whatever was the stated agenda for

479
00:21:16,780 --> 00:21:15,050
all those operations as horrible as they

480
00:21:19,660 --> 00:21:16,790
were you know MKULTRA or any of the rest

481
00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:19,670
that as horrible as they were there was

482
00:21:24,790 --> 00:21:22,610
a stated agenda that we bought into and

483
00:21:27,340 --> 00:21:24,800
we still buy into and we still wrap our

484
00:21:30,010 --> 00:21:27,350
wrap the flag around us and say yeah but

485
00:21:32,950 --> 00:21:30,020
at least we're better than them and yet

486
00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:32,960
as you're alluding to the message of the

487
00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:38,330
nine the message of mish loves aliens of

488
00:21:44,530 --> 00:21:41,330
over and over again everyone who enters

489
00:21:47,260 --> 00:21:44,540
this other realm is you got it all wrong

490
00:21:52,270 --> 00:21:47,270
that just isn't work that just doesn't

491
00:21:55,120 --> 00:21:52,280
work how did how did Puharich wrestle

492
00:21:56,320 --> 00:21:55,130
with those two realities because that

493
00:21:59,920 --> 00:21:56,330
that's the other thing I think you know

494
00:22:02,140 --> 00:21:59,930
we can't deny either of those realities

495
00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:02,150
do you have any sense is kind of a

496
00:22:08,050 --> 00:22:05,650
bringing it all together Greg how he

497
00:22:12,850 --> 00:22:08,060
resolved those for himself as he reached

498
00:22:16,900 --> 00:22:12,860
the end of his life yeah I think you

499
00:22:19,630 --> 00:22:16,910
know at the end of Andria's life as I've

500
00:22:23,020 --> 00:22:19,640
seen through some video footage and

501
00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:23,030
other recordings of him we're talking

502
00:22:28,990 --> 00:22:27,170
late 80s into the early 90s who has

503
00:22:31,390 --> 00:22:29,000
happen and he sort of became quite

504
00:22:35,140 --> 00:22:31,400
bitter I think you know he sort of had

505
00:22:38,080 --> 00:22:35,150
this entire life of trying to push these

506
00:22:39,790 --> 00:22:38,090
messages to people you know what if what

507
00:22:41,590 --> 00:22:39,800
if this is real let's not immediately

508
00:22:43,330 --> 00:22:41,600
debunk this let's not immediately throw

509
00:22:45,370 --> 00:22:43,340
this out the window let's let's sit and

510
00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:45,380
talk about it and you know after a

511
00:22:51,100 --> 00:22:48,050
lifetime of pushing that I think you

512
00:22:52,660 --> 00:22:51,110
know people were still scan of course

513
00:22:54,250 --> 00:22:52,670
people were so skeptical people were

514
00:22:55,900 --> 00:22:54,260
still debunking and I think he became

515
00:22:59,830 --> 00:22:55,910
very bitter about that there's a

516
00:23:02,380 --> 00:22:59,840
particular interview that I have of him

517
00:23:04,180 --> 00:23:02,390
I think in 93 and he's really just going

518
00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:04,190
off about this stuff I think he's very

519
00:23:09,940 --> 00:23:06,410
angry that you know his life's work

520
00:23:11,980 --> 00:23:09,950
didn't reach more people and you know he

521
00:23:13,450 --> 00:23:11,990
was bitter that you know these things he

522
00:23:16,180 --> 00:23:13,460
spent his whole life on

523
00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:16,190
and you know get as far as he would have

524
00:23:21,490 --> 00:23:19,850
wished and I think you know it really

525
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:21,500
raises an interesting question I think

526
00:23:25,870 --> 00:23:23,450
that's what's so great about doing a

527
00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:25,880
film on him is it's really hard to pin

528
00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:28,730
down you know what his real intentions

529
00:23:33,430 --> 00:23:31,850
were I mean if you look at the nine and

530
00:23:34,870 --> 00:23:33,440
like you said that deal is these these

531
00:23:37,060 --> 00:23:34,880
people who were involved in it these

532
00:23:39,789 --> 00:23:37,070
very very wealthy family is the CIA

533
00:23:41,769 --> 00:23:39,799
types I mean you know you've got to ask

534
00:23:43,210 --> 00:23:41,779
why why were they there

535
00:23:45,519 --> 00:23:43,220
why were they a part of this where they

536
00:23:47,950 --> 00:23:45,529
simply just intrigued by it did they

537
00:23:50,769 --> 00:23:47,960
have some sort of different agenda

538
00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:50,779
it's really really deep when you start

539
00:23:56,590 --> 00:23:53,210
asking these questions but I think you

540
00:23:58,779 --> 00:23:56,600
know who heart he really was a spiritual

541
00:24:00,490 --> 00:23:58,789
person you know the bitterness at the

542
00:24:03,220 --> 00:24:00,500
end of his life aside he was very

543
00:24:05,049 --> 00:24:03,230
spiritual I found out there was his son

544
00:24:07,570 --> 00:24:05,059
Andy who had worked a lot with on the

545
00:24:10,419 --> 00:24:07,580
film and his and his other siblings that

546
00:24:12,490 --> 00:24:10,429
you know he he he would take trips to to

547
00:24:14,380 --> 00:24:12,500
Israel and to to all these places around

548
00:24:18,669 --> 00:24:14,390
the world he was very interested in

549
00:24:21,000 --> 00:24:18,679
religions and he was just you know one

550
00:24:23,169 --> 00:24:21,010
of these guys who just was so

551
00:24:25,990 --> 00:24:23,179
open-minded to all these things and I

552
00:24:28,120 --> 00:24:26,000
and I think at the end of the day you

553
00:24:29,950 --> 00:24:28,130
know he really just put put this all out

554
00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:29,960
on the table and he just said this is my

555
00:24:33,669 --> 00:24:31,850
experience this is what happened to me

556
00:24:36,340 --> 00:24:33,679
throughout my life here's the early book

557
00:24:38,110 --> 00:24:36,350
here's the nine you know - take it or

558
00:24:39,340 --> 00:24:38,120
leave it that was really his attitude at

559
00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:39,350
the end of the day I think about all

560
00:24:43,389 --> 00:24:41,330
this kind of stuff and that's why I

561
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:43,399
think a film could it could be quite

562
00:24:48,100 --> 00:24:46,250
important because as we've discussed I

563
00:24:49,899 --> 00:24:48,110
mean he did so many amazing things you

564
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:49,909
can't just look at this guy and just say

565
00:24:54,310 --> 00:24:51,890
uh he was nuts you know

566
00:24:57,460 --> 00:24:54,320
let's move on here he really did some

567
00:25:01,149 --> 00:24:57,470
important things and absolutely so then

568
00:25:03,190 --> 00:25:01,159
tell us more about the film project how

569
00:25:07,120 --> 00:25:03,200
people can get involved how people can

570
00:25:08,769 --> 00:25:07,130
support it the basics of have you

571
00:25:11,470 --> 00:25:08,779
decided how much money you need to raise

572
00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:11,480
is part of the Kickstarter campaign when

573
00:25:16,149 --> 00:25:13,610
will the film be out how long where will

574
00:25:17,710 --> 00:25:16,159
it be distributed anything like that if

575
00:25:20,740 --> 00:25:17,720
people might want to know before they

576
00:25:22,629 --> 00:25:20,750
kind of become involved yeah well we

577
00:25:24,350 --> 00:25:22,639
have been working on this for quite some

578
00:25:28,190 --> 00:25:24,360
time

579
00:25:30,380 --> 00:25:28,200
but basically in order to have the

580
00:25:32,299 --> 00:25:30,390
creative control that I think is

581
00:25:34,430 --> 00:25:32,309
important for a film like this we're

582
00:25:37,250 --> 00:25:34,440
trying to finish it ourselves so we're

583
00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:37,260
doing a Kickstarter for the film and if

584
00:25:47,750 --> 00:25:45,330
you go to WWE are each film calm there

585
00:25:52,070 --> 00:25:47,760
will be a link to that Kickstarter page

586
00:25:54,350 --> 00:25:52,080
and you know it's it's very important I

587
00:25:57,140 --> 00:25:54,360
think not just for the film but you know

588
00:25:59,450 --> 00:25:57,150
a lot of the archives that I've been you

589
00:26:02,390 --> 00:25:59,460
know who live privileged enough to be

590
00:26:05,750 --> 00:26:02,400
given I mean this is stuff that it's

591
00:26:07,610 --> 00:26:05,760
very important and should be preserved

592
00:26:09,890 --> 00:26:07,620
so a lot of the the money that we'll

593
00:26:11,780 --> 00:26:09,900
raise will go to you know getting this

594
00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:11,790
stuff digitized and EBU harge left

595
00:26:17,060 --> 00:26:14,730
behind maybe several hundred slide

596
00:26:19,039 --> 00:26:17,070
photographs dating back to the 40s that

597
00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:19,049
have never been seen never been never

598
00:26:22,780 --> 00:26:20,730
been scanned or digitized so you know

599
00:26:25,210 --> 00:26:22,790
the money will go to that sort of stuff

600
00:26:27,590 --> 00:26:25,220
we've also been talking with

601
00:26:29,570 --> 00:26:27,600
Northwestern University where as I

602
00:26:32,690 --> 00:26:29,580
mentioned blue arch has a medical degree

603
00:26:34,700 --> 00:26:32,700
from they have sort of recognized the

604
00:26:36,500 --> 00:26:34,710
legacy of Puharich and they're they're

605
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:36,510
interested in sort of setting up some

606
00:26:41,900 --> 00:26:38,970
material in their library in the Special

607
00:26:44,270 --> 00:26:41,910
Collections section of their library so

608
00:26:46,039 --> 00:26:44,280
you know we'll put some stuff there but

609
00:26:49,669 --> 00:26:46,049
yeah we will have the Kickstarter page

610
00:26:51,799 --> 00:26:49,679
going you know if anyone's interested in

611
00:26:53,180 --> 00:26:51,809
the world of parapsychology or

612
00:26:56,539 --> 00:26:53,190
consciousness or anything this is

613
00:27:00,200 --> 00:26:56,549
obviously a important project and we're

614
00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:00,210
not looking for for too much but you

615
00:27:03,110 --> 00:27:01,290
know you'll you'll find all the

616
00:27:05,419 --> 00:27:03,120
information on the Kickstarter page

617
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:05,429
great great well we will definitely have

618
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:08,010
it linked up and we'll stay on top of

619
00:27:12,409 --> 00:27:10,410
this project once it gets going maybe

620
00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:12,419
you can come back on after the film

621
00:27:17,150 --> 00:27:14,850
takes shape and certainly as it's being

622
00:27:21,590 --> 00:27:17,160
released we'll have you back on and

623
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:21,600
follow up on this story yeah Greg it's

624
00:27:25,669 --> 00:27:23,850
been great having you on thanks again so

625
00:27:28,820 --> 00:27:25,679
much for joining me on skeptic oh and

626
00:27:33,070 --> 00:27:28,830
best of luck with this really important

627
00:27:35,499 --> 00:27:33,080
work thanks Alex appreciate it

628
00:27:37,389 --> 00:27:35,509
so thanks for watching this video if it

629
00:27:39,970 --> 00:27:37,399
wasn't really a video but just an audio

630
00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:39,980
stored as a video well I apologize but

631
00:27:43,479 --> 00:27:41,570
there's more videos out there as well

632
00:27:45,340 --> 00:27:43,489
but please check out the skeptic Oh

633
00:27:46,690 --> 00:27:45,350
website you can see it here we cover a

634
00:27:49,509 --> 00:27:46,700
lot of different stuff you might be

635
00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:49,519
interested in relating to controversial

636
00:27:55,539 --> 00:27:52,850
science and spirituality a lot of shows

637
00:27:58,389 --> 00:27:55,549
up there over 350 of them are so all

638
00:28:00,720 --> 00:27:58,399
free all available for downloads so do